Subject: Twelve Course Lutes

From: BENJAMIN NARVEY <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 17 May 2014 19:09:10 +0200

Dear All,

   Does anybody on this list have any experience with 12c lutes? I am
   considering getting one if I can get the funds together and I would be
   grateful for any counsel drawn from actual experience. I have never
   even laid finger to fret on one of these lutes before, so it is a bit
   of a leap of faith. That said, there is clearly so much music that
   could be played in either "vieux ton" or "nouveau ton" on this lute,
   and I think it is the ultimate historical continuo beast for so much
   17c repertoire, in particular English music (Purcell, Lawes, etc.)

   Also: string lengths. I know they can be very small (around 55cm) to
   very big (perhaps 76cm or so). Any suggestions? I am kind of torn
   between having perhaps a smaller solo instrument and a larger one that
   I could use for accompaniment.

   Any thoughts?

   Best wishes,

   Benjamin

   --
   [1]www.luthiste.com
   t +33 (0) 1 44 27 03 44
   p/m +33 (0) 6 71 79 98 98
   --

References

   1. http://www.luthiste.com/

---

From: James Jackson <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 17 May 2014 20:01:47 +0100

Hi there,
   I currently hire a 12c lute, from the UK Lute Society, the description
   on their website: "no. 44: 12 course double-headed lute by David van
   Edwards summer school (2010), 673, 720, 780, 850, 938 mm, currently in
   French flat tuning but can be retuned to baroque D minor at A92 (i.e. C
   minor at modern pitch), grade A"
   I currently have it in D minor at A92. You can go see it by going
   toA [1]http://www.lutesociety.org/pages/hire-lutes and scrolling down
   to lute number 44.
   It's great at playing the Scottish D minor repertoire of the Balcarres
   MS, sounds great on early French baroque lute music, and because it has
   a 12th course, opens up almost all of S.L. Weiss, et al, omitting the
   13th and playing the 6th instead.
   I really enjoy my "foster" 12 course very much in D minor tuning.
   I hope that is of help,
   Kind regards,
   James

   On 17 May 2014 18:09, BENJAMIN NARVEY <[2][email-masked]> wrote:

     A  A Dear All,
     A  A Does anybody on this list have any experience with 12c lutes? I
     am
     A  A considering getting one if I can get the funds together and I
     would be
     A  A grateful for any counsel drawn from actual experience. I have
     never
     A  A even laid finger to fret on one of these lutes before, so it is
     a bit
     A  A of a leap of faith. That said, there is clearly so much music
     that
     A  A could be played in either "vieux ton" or "nouveau ton" on this
     lute,
     A  A and I think it is the ultimate historical continuo beast for so
     much
     A  A 17c repertoire, in particular English music (Purcell, Lawes,
     etc.)
     A  A Also: string lengths. I know they can be very small (around
     55cm) to
     A  A very big (perhaps 76cm or so). Any suggestions? I am kind of
     torn
     A  A between having perhaps a smaller solo instrument and a larger
     one that
     A  A I could use for accompaniment.
     A  A Any thoughts?
     A  A Best wishes,
     A  A Benjamin
     A  A --
     A  A [1][3]www.luthiste.com
     A  A t [4]+33 (0) 1 44 27 03 44
     A  A p/m [5]+33 (0) 6 71 79 98 98
     A  A --
     References
     A  A 1. [6]http://www.luthiste.com/
     To get on or off this list see list information at
     [7]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

   --

References

   1. http://www.lutesociety.org/pages/hire-lutes
   2. mailto:[email-masked]
   3. http://www.luthiste.com/
   4. tel:%2B33%20%280%29%201%2044%2027%2003%2044
   5. tel:%2B33%20%280%29%206%2071%2079%2098%2098
   6. http://www.luthiste.com/
   7. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

---

From: James Jackson <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 16:39:01 +0100

Of course, I assume everyone knows by A, I meant 392! ;)
   Cheers!
   James

   On 17 May 2014 20:01, James Jackson <[1][email-masked]>
   wrote:

   A  A Hi there,
   A  A I currently hire a 12c lute, from the UK Lute Society, the
   description
   A  A on their website: "no. 44: 12 course double-headed lute by David
   van
   A  A Edwards summer school (2010), 673, 720, 780, 850, 938 mm,
   currently in

     A  A French flat tuning but can be retuned to baroque D minor at A92
     (i.e. C

   A  A minor at modern pitch), grade A"

     A  A I currently have it in D minor at A92. You can go see it by
     going
     A  A toA [1][2]http://www.lutesociety.org/pages/hire-lutes and
     scrolling down

   A  A to lute number 44.
   A  A It's great at playing the Scottish D minor repertoire of the
   Balcarres
   A  A MS, sounds great on early French baroque lute music, and because
   it has
   A  A a 12th course, opens up almost all of S.L. Weiss, et al, omitting
   the
   A  A 13th and playing the 6th instead.
   A  A I really enjoy my "foster" 12 course very much in D minor tuning.
   A  A I hope that is of help,
   A  A Kind regards,
   A  A James

     A  A On 17 May 2014 18:09, BENJAMIN NARVEY
     <[2][3][email-masked]> wrote:
     A  A  A A A A Dear All,
     A  A  A A A A Does anybody on this list have any experience with 12c
     lutes? I
     A  A  A am
     A  A  A A A A considering getting one if I can get the funds
     together and I
     A  A  A would be
     A  A  A A A A grateful for any counsel drawn from actual experience.
     I have
     A  A  A never
     A  A  A A A A even laid finger to fret on one of these lutes before,
     so it is
     A  A  A a bit
     A  A  A A A A of a leap of faith. That said, there is clearly so
     much music
     A  A  A that
     A  A  A A A A could be played in either "vieux ton" or "nouveau ton"
     on this
     A  A  A lute,
     A  A  A A A A and I think it is the ultimate historical continuo
     beast for so
     A  A  A much
     A  A  A A A A 17c repertoire, in particular English music (Purcell,
     Lawes,
     A  A  A etc.)
     A  A  A A A A Also: string lengths. I know they can be very small
     (around
     A  A  A 55cm) to
     A  A  A A A A very big (perhaps 76cm or so). Any suggestions? I am
     kind of
     A  A  A torn
     A  A  A A A A between having perhaps a smaller solo instrument and a
     larger
     A  A  A one that
     A  A  A A A A I could use for accompaniment.
     A  A  A A A A Any thoughts?
     A  A  A A A A Best wishes,
     A  A  A A A A Benjamin
     A  A  A A A A --
     A  A  A A A A [1][3][4]www.luthiste.com
     A  A  A A A A t [4][5]+33 (0) 1 44 27 03 44
     A  A  A A A A p/m [5][6]+33 (0) 6 71 79 98 98
     A  A  A A A A --
     A  A  A References
     A  A  A A A A 1. [6][7]http://www.luthiste.com/

   A  A  A To get on or off this list see list information at

     A  A  A [7][8]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
     A  A --
     References
     A  A 1. [9]http://www.lutesociety.org/pages/hire-lutes
     A  A 2. mailto:[10][email-masked]
     A  A 3. [11]http://www.luthiste.com/
     A  A 4. tel:%2B33%20%280%29%201%2044%2027%2003%2044
     A  A 5. tel:%2B33%20%280%29%206%2071%2079%2098%2098
     A  A 6. [12]http://www.luthiste.com/
     A  A 7. [13]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

   --

References

   1. mailto:[email-masked]
   2. http://www.lutesociety.org/pages/hire-lutes
   3. mailto:[email-masked]
   4. http://www.luthiste.com/
   5. tel:%2B33%20%280%29%201%2044%2027%2003%2044
   6. tel:%2B33%20%280%29%206%2071%2079%2098%2098
   7. http://www.luthiste.com/
   8. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
   9. http://www.lutesociety.org/pages/hire-lutes
  10. mailto:[email-masked]
  11. http://www.luthiste.com/
  12. http://www.luthiste.com/
  13. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

---

From: James Jackson <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 17:41:56 +0100

I'm getting some very odd rearrangement of letters in my messages - a
   server problem perhaps?
   Letter A is disappearing and D is getting on converted to A and numbers
   I'm typing are disappearing - weird!
   James.

   On 18 May 2014 16:39, James Jackson <[1][email-masked]>
   wrote:

     A  A Of course, I assume everyone knows by A, I meant 392! ;)
     A  A Cheers!
     A  A James
     A  A On 17 May 2014 20:01, James Jackson
     <[1][2][email-masked]>
     A  A wrote:
     A  A A A A Hi there,
     A  A A A A I currently hire a 12c lute, from the UK Lute Society,
     the
     A  A description
     A  A A A A on their website: "no. 44: 12 course double-headed lute
     by David
     A  A van
     A  A A A A Edwards summer school (2010), 673, 720, 780, 850, 938 mm,
     A  A currently in
     A  A  A A A A French flat tuning but can be retuned to baroque D
     minor at A92
     A  A  A (i.e. C
     A  A A A A minor at modern pitch), grade A"

   A  A  A A A A I currently have it in D minor at A92. You can go see it
   by
   A  A  A going

     A  A  A A A A toA
     [1][2][3]http://www.lutesociety.org/pages/hire-lutes and
     A  A  A scrolling down
     A  A A A A to lute number 44.
     A  A A A A It's great at playing the Scottish D minor repertoire of
     the
     A  A Balcarres
     A  A A A A MS, sounds great on early French baroque lute music, and
     because
     A  A it has
     A  A A A A a 12th course, opens up almost all of S.L. Weiss, et al,
     omitting
     A  A the
     A  A A A A 13th and playing the 6th instead.
     A  A A A A I really enjoy my "foster" 12 course very much in D minor
     tuning.
     A  A A A A I hope that is of help,
     A  A A A A Kind regards,
     A  A A A A James
     A  A  A A A A On 17 May 2014 18:09, BENJAMIN NARVEY
     A  A  A <[2][3][4][email-masked]> wrote:
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A Dear All,
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A Does anybody on this list have any
     experience with 12c
     A  A  A lutes? I
     A  A  A A A A A A am
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A considering getting one if I can get the
     funds
     A  A  A together and I
     A  A  A A A A A A would be
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A grateful for any counsel drawn from actual
     experience.
     A  A  A I have
     A  A  A A A A A A never
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A even laid finger to fret on one of these
     lutes before,
     A  A  A so it is
     A  A  A A A A A A a bit
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A of a leap of faith. That said, there is
     clearly so
     A  A  A much music
     A  A  A A A A A A that
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A could be played in either "vieux ton" or
     "nouveau ton"
     A  A  A on this
     A  A  A A A A A A lute,
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A and I think it is the ultimate historical
     continuo
     A  A  A beast for so
     A  A  A A A A A A much
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A 17c repertoire, in particular English music
     (Purcell,
     A  A  A Lawes,
     A  A  A A A A A A etc.)
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A Also: string lengths. I know they can be
     very small
     A  A  A (around
     A  A  A A A A A A 55cm) to
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A very big (perhaps 76cm or so). Any
     suggestions? I am
     A  A  A kind of
     A  A  A A A A A A torn
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A between having perhaps a smaller solo
     instrument and a
     A  A  A larger
     A  A  A A A A A A one that
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A I could use for accompaniment.
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A Any thoughts?
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A Best wishes,
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A Benjamin
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A --
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A [1][3][4][5]www.luthiste.com
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A t [4][5][6]+33 (0) 1 44 27 03 44
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A p/m [5][6][7]+33 (0) 6 71 79 98 98
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A --
     A  A  A A A A A A References
     A  A  A A A A A A A A A 1. [6][7][8]http://www.luthiste.com/
     A  A A A A A A To get on or off this list see list information at
     A  A  A A A A A A
     [7][8][9]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
     A  A  A A A A --
     A  A  A References
     A  A  A A A A 1. [9][10]http://www.lutesociety.org/pages/hire-lutes
     A  A  A A A A 2. mailto:[10][11][email-masked]
     A  A  A A A A 3. [11][12]http://www.luthiste.com/
     A  A  A A A A 4. tel:%2B33%20%280%29%201%2044%2027%2003%2044
     A  A  A A A A 5. tel:%2B33%20%280%29%206%2071%2079%2098%2098
     A  A  A A A A 6. [12][13]http://www.luthiste.com/
     A  A  A A A A 7.
     [13][14]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
     A  A --
     References
     A  A 1. mailto:[15][email-masked]
     A  A 2. [16]http://www.lutesociety.org/pages/hire-lutes
     A  A 3. mailto:[17][email-masked]
     A  A 4. [18]http://www.luthiste.com/
     A  A 5. tel:%2B33%20%280%29%201%2044%2027%2003%2044
     A  A 6. tel:%2B33%20%280%29%206%2071%2079%2098%2098
     A  A 7. [19]http://www.luthiste.com/
     A  A 8. [20]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
     A  A 9. [21]http://www.lutesociety.org/pages/hire-lutes
     A  10. mailto:[22][email-masked]
     A  11. [23]http://www.luthiste.com/
     A  12. [24]http://www.luthiste.com/
     A  13. [25]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

   --

References

   1. mailto:[email-masked]
   2. mailto:[email-masked]
   3. http://www.lutesociety.org/pages/hire-lutes
   4. mailto:[email-masked]
   5. http://www.luthiste.com/
   6. tel:%2B33%20%280%29%201%2044%2027%2003%2044
   7. tel:%2B33%20%280%29%206%2071%2079%2098%2098
   8. http://www.luthiste.com/
   9. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
  10. http://www.lutesociety.org/pages/hire-lutes
  11. mailto:[email-masked]
  12. http://www.luthiste.com/
  13. http://www.luthiste.com/
  14. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
  15. mailto:[email-masked]
  16. http://www.lutesociety.org/pages/hire-lutes
  17. mailto:[email-masked]
  18. http://www.luthiste.com/
  19. http://www.luthiste.com/
  20. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
  21. http://www.lutesociety.org/pages/hire-lutes
  22. mailto:[email-masked]
  23. http://www.luthiste.com/
  24. http://www.luthiste.com/
  25. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

---

From: Bernd Haegemann <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 18 May 2014 19:08:45 +0200

>     I'm typing are disappearing - weird!
That happens always when they get new trainees in the NSA...

B